Speaking as a citizen of another Western country, the cowardice & inaction of those police officers involved, absolutely disgusts & infuriates me, as it does many acquaintences. They should be incarcerated for dereliction of duty, permitting mass murder by inaction, gross negligence, faulure to perform their sworn duty if care, & etc. They should all be publicly named & shamed. Disgusting, yellow bellied cowards.
One thing I know: given the choice between dying in the line of duty trying to protect children or standing around with my finger up my ass while they were slaughtered, the former would be an easy choice because I’d never be able to live with the utter humiliation of the latter.
And to compound the humiliation the police chief lies about what happened to cover their cowardice. I’d never be able to show my face in that town (or look in the mirror) again.
These pussies will carry their guilt and shame to their graves.
“We did a good job, we contained him to a classroom”. Contemptible.
They won’t save innocent children from slaughter, but you can be sure they’d happily mace and beat with a baton a little old lady who wasn’t wearing her mask.
These aren’t men. At least not in the key ways (need a reminder? Let’s start with honor and courage) that used to define men.
Yep. Fellow attorney here. This is what I posted on FB yesterday re: the same issue.
Obviously school shootings are in the news again. I'd like to point out an aspect of the issue that media and politicians never seem to mention (for obvious reasons):
1: Government makes schooling mandatory. Which means that due to various circumstances, most people send their children to government schools.
2: Government made laws generally (with exceptions) preventing government employees, agencies, etc... from being held liable for the results of the acts and omissions of those government employees and agencies under the legal doctrine of "qualified immunity", other immunity doctrines and legal provisions.
3: The result is that, for example, Courts have held that law enforcement officers have no legal duty to protect individuals in the general public. See Warren v. D.C. (horrific facts involving multiple rapes and police inaction to prevent the rapes), among others:
"... the fundamental principle that a government and its agents are under no general duty to provide public services, such as police protection, to any particular individual citizen."
4: Similarly, generally, a government school and it's employees and law enforcement would not be held liable for failure to protect the children at the school.
"It is historically very challenging to hold a school district legally responsible for a shooting, said Chuck Vergon, a professor of education law at Youngstown State University.
A majority of past school shooting cases featured some kind of warning in advance of potential violence, he said. But it is difficult in most state courts to meet the required standard of proving gross negligence on the part of school officials — that they acted in “wanton and willful disregard” for the safety or well-being of others, he said. “That standard has usually shielded school officials in most school shooting cases from civil liability.”
5: To my understanding of the law (I'd welcome additional information that might show otherwise), private schools could more easily be held liable for failure to protect students. Which could be a reason why school shootings are less common at private schools. Perhaps private schools have better security. Or a better culture that doesn't result in pissing off some students who might come back to shoot up the place.
6: So what we have is government mandating that kids attend school, which - because of various circumstances de facto means that government is mandating that most kids attend GOVERNMENT schools. And government has passed laws to prevent itself from being liable in most instances for failure to protect the children that government mandated be placed in government care.
7: As such, there is minimal motivation - legally speaking - for government to ensure that children are protected in government schools. It is far easier for politicians to stir up division over guns than it is to take action to protect children. Arguing in the media over gun rights gets viewers and attention. Strong, practical action to protect kids doesn't as much.
8: Notice that when government wants to, government is quite able to protect people. Presidents and other prominent politicians have trained guards with guns, as well as substantial other security measures to ensure their protection and safety.
Those government agents KNOW that those methods work to prevent shootings and such. That being the case - even though a substantial percentage of the population is annoyed or angry at a particular politician at a particular time... and even though a small percentage of those people might be annoyed or angry enough to try something desperate.
Yet we rarely see attempts on politicians' and other government officials' lives (the Congressional baseball game incident 5 years ago being a prominent relatively recent exception). Their security is effective - even though there are just as many guns in society that could be used to attack politicians as there are that could be used to attack schools and children.
So why aren't similar measures implemented in relation to schools?
Possible answers:
A: Politicians and other government officials care more about their own safety than the safety of children.
B: Politicians would rather have an issue with which to leverage votes and media attention than to actually solve the issue.
C: Politicians realize that the general public doesn't want that degree of protection for their children because of the disruption and fear that could cause.
But if that's a/the reason, then that implies that the general public is ok with a lower level of safety for schoolchildren than for politicians... and that means that the general public will accept a higher amount of risk for schoolchildren potentially being the victim of a school shooting. That may well be - there are ALWAYS trade offs. We cannot rid the world of ALL risk... and ridding the world of even most risks results in a less than ideal day-to-day life).
These aren't easy issues.
But I can guarantee you that if government were actually legally liable for failing to protect children in government schools, then the children would be a lot better protected than they are now.
Government has chosen not to accept that liability. And the children suffer for it sometimes.
Perhaps we should have a national discussion about THAT issue at the same time that people are arguing about guns.
May 29, 2022·edited May 29, 2022Liked by Michael P Senger
I’m a parent of a child in a fatal school shooting on 12/13/2013 at Arapahoe Highschool , in the same district as Columbine in Littleton CO. I spent 9 years researching and speaking out as well as exposing lies cover ups and corruption. I’ll link you and others to 2 reports. Nicolletis secority report was invited to be read by LPS district. Dr Goodrums was ignored. At all our peril. Yes, security is important in terms of locked access to building. However if a shooter wants to get in they can. The doors open for each person buzzed in. The shooter can still grab the door. I know. I’ve done it. SROs ( security resource officers which are off duty cops ) have NEVER stopped a school shooting. And as far as I know by the time cops show up the shooters dead. Especially if the shooter was a student. I’m response Your # 5 comment about private schools : most private schools here a MuCH lower ratio of teacher to student which lowers stress on students ( and teachers ). Teachers are paid better and many top teachers work in private schools. This leaving unqualified incompetent unkind ones in public schools. Private schools don’t teach crap like Common Core or use unnecessary ( but a way to steal tax dollars and surveille students ) chrome books with Gates software and testing which causes severe depression among students. And teachers who must “ teach to the test “. Private schools aren’t top heavy with admin wfo are mostly degreed from online Phoenix University ( look up all admin background in public schools to get an idea ). Most private schools teach interesting subjects focused in real education. Parents won’t pay if their kids are unhappy and teachers or admin are unresponsive. Although I’m a SPED expert and have had all 3 of my kids in public , charter , private and homeschool , I’m a public school proponent. What’s occurring now for the past 40 years is neo liberal fascism. I’m a theories expert and. was a life long Democrat. None of these neo liberals or neo conservatives are “ liberal “ or “ conservative “. They’re not communists or Marxist’s as ignorant people throw these terms around. It’s fascism. Neither communism or “ free market “ Capitalism ever work. I’m also a pro 2nd amendment person. In terms of the cops , I’ve explored many school shootings. Many have been false flags ( yes with real or faked deaths ) and some are real shootings. Columbine was areal shooting with one kid who was a sociopath and Kleibold who was depressed and on psychotropic drugs. Other cases are MKULTRA. Arapahoe was real. The student / shooter was known to be a threat and the idiot admin CyA’d. They ignored and then fired the guards who knew and spoke out. The SRO never got to Pierson the shooter. The guards confronted Pierson. The SRO was awarded a medal from Arapahoe sheriffs Dept which he didn’t earn. I called all of it out and was attacked and gaslit. I single-handedly spoke out about bullying by admin and teachers against parents and kids. The truth finally came out in part. The new superintendent listened and admitted our district had bullying ,anti semitism ,racism ,homophobia . He wrote a letter to all family in district in 2016. LPS still hasn’t got text to alert. They left the admin criminals in charge. Suicides are down. But it’s still rotten. Cops are cowards for the most part and frankly this latest incident can’t just be chalked up to cowardice or incompetence. I believe some of it was synthetically created. I don’t believe all teachers should be armed unless they are lifelong gun enthusiasts. Some teachers who were allowed to carry had mental breakdowns ajd threatened innocent STUDENTS in the past. I do support conceal carry in schools strongly as it could definitely stop a shooter. I will link everyone to both national violence reports. Nicolletis report is NOT the answer. Yes it can help with non school student shooters. Public schools are ACTIVELY violating students sped rights ( special Ed ) and IEPs. They are mostly incompetent as well , not knowing sped law , as in the case of the student shooter at my sons school. Most public school admin bully amd intimidate parents students and teachers. It’s irrelevant if some parents suck. The law states publuc schools must serve ALL kids. Even. Kids with shitty parents. So blaming parents is useless and unproductive. 20% of all students are at risk whether they’re SPED, gifted, depressed or have other ED, and ignored sped kids wfo should be identified and serviced. Steve the dysarvabtaged instead of blaming and the shootings ajd suicides will plummet wfich protects ALL of our kids!This requires knowledge , intentional competency , emotional IQ and MONEY ! A lot of money is stolen through the avenues i mentioned plus more. Anyone interested in discussing this can email me with the subject line : School Shootings at hs4265@protonmail.com. Read the links before emailing please. Here are the violence reports and the link to my FB page I started a month after the shooting. Most reporters wouldn’t publicize the facts I exposed. My page : https://m.facebook.com/Parents-at-Arapahoe-High-school-643470752378413/. Nicollettis report : https://schoolshooters.info/sites/default/files/Threat_Assessment_Issues.pdf. Dr Sarah goodrum’s crucial report , ignored by LPS : https://cspv.colorado.edu/arapahoe-high-school-shooting-report-preventing-future-school-shootings-through-information-sharing-threat-assessment-and-systems-thinking/. Could someone please comment and respond whether they can see all 3 links and if those links worked please ? I can’t see it on my end for some reason. Ty
My x-husband cop and retired BIL trooper went into many volatile situations, not know what was on the other side. Both of these officers would risk their lives and go into an active shooting incident to save children - or anyone. Please don’t condemn ALL police. Investigate, once the truth comes out, those who were at fault should be dealt with.
I agree. My emotional reaction is of course to condemn all police, and I suspect that that's exactly one of the desired outcomes, totally in line with the BLM and ACAB bs that we've had to suffer these past years. The other desired outcome is of course the old banning of guns for citizens, leaving the monopoly on violence entirely in the hands of the ruling class.
The "official timeline" in the linked LA Times article also says:
"He was finally killed after more than an hour, after a Border Patrol special weapons team arrived."
However, a story on Fox News is saying that the Border Patrol officer that shot the killer was off duty and had responded after his wife, a teacher at the school, texted him requesting help.
"An off-duty US Customs and Border Patrol agent saved dozens of children trapped inside Robb Elementary Tuesday after his wife, a fourth-grade teacher at the school, texted him that there was an active shooter, according to a report"
I think there were some cops that wanted to go in because some went in to get their kids in other classrooms.
However I said this three times in the last month as a caller into talk radio. I’m not sure that police and govt law enforcement are with the good guys and it’s time for them to choose. Why? The threat of losing their paychecks and pensions have them following the orders of their superiors and mayors and governors when they know it’s wrong.
How many dads and moms reading this would have gone in as non police officers to save those kids even if they aren’t our own? I bet on many. I would with no hesitation. Why did the police not? They were told to follow the process.
Can’t get the front door open? I don’t wait for a key. I drive my car through it. They were told they have to wait to breach.
The problem with all of these mass shootings is one of mental health in USA. Teenagers are more and more hypermedicated and making us suffer the consequences. When we start giving them anphetamines as kids, antidepressants as young teenagers and antipsychotics later on, something is not working in the American Health System these days. Nutrition is a big problem and also probable cause for this mental health crisis and we should not underestimate the role of hypervaccination in babies.
Just wait until our military is tested and they don't have to fear being ostracized for doing their jobs. Our world is convoluted, confused and upside down. We cannot expect normal or good outcomes to be the rule anymore.
I guess that every real men left the police after some cucks decided to embarrass the corporation by taking "the knee" for blm, antifa, and other criminals. Now these blm-kneeling cowards are all that is left in the police.
Lots of problems here. Cops vilified for shooting “people of color”, the George Floyd death and conviction, etc. makes them afraid to act out. The security door left unlocked “because the school year was ending” (?!) What I want to see are armed guards on duty at schools and, ideally, armed teachers or the impression of such. But if I was a parent I’d be homeschooling for this and other reasons. And find a cooperative way to do it even if I had little money.
One news account reported there were only 4 cops. The city has a small police force. One wonders how well the 4 cops were trained in shooting cases like this.
So far I have found no corroboration of the claim that the shooter fired several rounds outside before he entered the school. Wouldn't that info have come from parents? How long had the children been in class?
Accusing the cops of cowardice seems both appropriate and a cheap shot. Were they wearing bullet protection vests? How well had they been trained for shooter intervention? The situation seems more like a unwinnable situation - someone was going to die, so the question came down to who.
Count me as cynical, but I doubt Americans will find common ground - excuses will be made. Perhaps the parents will be found guilty! And the MSM will eat it up.
They were cowards. They were stopping the parents from going in and handcuffed a mother. After she got out of the cuffs, she ran into the school and saved her 2 kids, even though the shooter was in the building. She had no training---she acted on instinct. Looks like the cops were trained to avoid doing anything.
"someone was going to die, so the question came down to who."
First, that's not true. Reports seems to show that law enforcement had body armor. It would be surprising if they didn't. As such, death of one or more officers was hardly guaranteed if they took action sooner.
And it is cowardice to answer that question by letting children be the ones to die while protecting yourself when YOU'RE A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER who has to receive weapons training before becoming an officer and have continuing training in the same.
The parents were willing to die to save their kids and law enforcement appears to have prevented them from doing so. That's not only cowardice, it's cruel.
Something to consider. The case of Sgt Dan O’Shea, Denver Police Department off-duty SWAT who led a small team of brave police to take on Klebold and Harris in Columbine while the rest of the LEO loitered outside trying to figure out what, if anything, to do as the rampage and carnage of innocent children continued inside. Investigated by his department, local and state prosecutors, sued by parents of a child killed claiming he was shot to death by O’Shea’s “reckless” intervention.
I knew Sgt Dan O’Shea. Long time veteran of DPD, instructor at the police academy, grizzled, tough cop who loved hard, lived life hard, did everything he did in life to the nth. Including putting his life on the line for others in harm’s way. Investigated, suspended and sued for his efforts.
Probably why so many of the LEO responders in Uvalde sat on their asses. And in Parkland. Despite protocols changing in every jurisdiction after Columbine, with hundreds of millions of dollars spent training local police departments. Still doing nothing, money and training wasted as children die in real time while police cowardly afraid to “protect and serve.”
I was with Sgt Dan O’Shea a few years after Columbine the night he took the call from his attorney telling him he was cleared of wrongdoing in the investigation and dropped from the lawsuit. He was a regular at a local bar I was a semi-regular at. Watching that man’s face, seeing his body, his entire being respond to the good news was a moment I’ll never forget. I shared his moment of vindication and the weight of the world that had weighed upon him for so many years after that tragic day leave him was powerful to behold. He bought the entire bar shots to celebrate, hugged many friends, me included as the news sunk in. This is what holds good police back from doing what Sgt Dan O’Shea did. Thing is, really good cops would do it anyways and suffer the consequences. Sgt Dan O’Shea would do it all over again the same way knowing what the next few years of his life would look like. They care that much. Rare today.
It's not guns or cops. We need serious conversation about "why so many of our country’s most lost, most hateful people are boys with their whole lives ahead of them." Children killing children.
Police are legally protected for cowardice. This is so hard to swallow. The heartache and sheer insanity of these times knows no bounds.
Speaking as a citizen of another Western country, the cowardice & inaction of those police officers involved, absolutely disgusts & infuriates me, as it does many acquaintences. They should be incarcerated for dereliction of duty, permitting mass murder by inaction, gross negligence, faulure to perform their sworn duty if care, & etc. They should all be publicly named & shamed. Disgusting, yellow bellied cowards.
One thing I know: given the choice between dying in the line of duty trying to protect children or standing around with my finger up my ass while they were slaughtered, the former would be an easy choice because I’d never be able to live with the utter humiliation of the latter.
And to compound the humiliation the police chief lies about what happened to cover their cowardice. I’d never be able to show my face in that town (or look in the mirror) again.
These pussies will carry their guilt and shame to their graves.
“We did a good job, we contained him to a classroom”. Contemptible.
I have a “back the blue” sticker on my rear window. It will not be there this time tomorrow.
They won’t save innocent children from slaughter, but you can be sure they’d happily mace and beat with a baton a little old lady who wasn’t wearing her mask.
These aren’t men. At least not in the key ways (need a reminder? Let’s start with honor and courage) that used to define men.
Revolting.
Yep. Fellow attorney here. This is what I posted on FB yesterday re: the same issue.
Obviously school shootings are in the news again. I'd like to point out an aspect of the issue that media and politicians never seem to mention (for obvious reasons):
1: Government makes schooling mandatory. Which means that due to various circumstances, most people send their children to government schools.
2: Government made laws generally (with exceptions) preventing government employees, agencies, etc... from being held liable for the results of the acts and omissions of those government employees and agencies under the legal doctrine of "qualified immunity", other immunity doctrines and legal provisions.
3: The result is that, for example, Courts have held that law enforcement officers have no legal duty to protect individuals in the general public. See Warren v. D.C. (horrific facts involving multiple rapes and police inaction to prevent the rapes), among others:
"... the fundamental principle that a government and its agents are under no general duty to provide public services, such as police protection, to any particular individual citizen."
https://law.justia.com/cases/district-of-columbia/court-of-appeals/1981/79-6-3.html
4: Similarly, generally, a government school and it's employees and law enforcement would not be held liable for failure to protect the children at the school.
"It is historically very challenging to hold a school district legally responsible for a shooting, said Chuck Vergon, a professor of education law at Youngstown State University.
A majority of past school shooting cases featured some kind of warning in advance of potential violence, he said. But it is difficult in most state courts to meet the required standard of proving gross negligence on the part of school officials — that they acted in “wanton and willful disregard” for the safety or well-being of others, he said. “That standard has usually shielded school officials in most school shooting cases from civil liability.”
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/12/04/us/oxford-high-school-responsibility-legal.html
5: To my understanding of the law (I'd welcome additional information that might show otherwise), private schools could more easily be held liable for failure to protect students. Which could be a reason why school shootings are less common at private schools. Perhaps private schools have better security. Or a better culture that doesn't result in pissing off some students who might come back to shoot up the place.
6: So what we have is government mandating that kids attend school, which - because of various circumstances de facto means that government is mandating that most kids attend GOVERNMENT schools. And government has passed laws to prevent itself from being liable in most instances for failure to protect the children that government mandated be placed in government care.
7: As such, there is minimal motivation - legally speaking - for government to ensure that children are protected in government schools. It is far easier for politicians to stir up division over guns than it is to take action to protect children. Arguing in the media over gun rights gets viewers and attention. Strong, practical action to protect kids doesn't as much.
8: Notice that when government wants to, government is quite able to protect people. Presidents and other prominent politicians have trained guards with guns, as well as substantial other security measures to ensure their protection and safety.
Those government agents KNOW that those methods work to prevent shootings and such. That being the case - even though a substantial percentage of the population is annoyed or angry at a particular politician at a particular time... and even though a small percentage of those people might be annoyed or angry enough to try something desperate.
Yet we rarely see attempts on politicians' and other government officials' lives (the Congressional baseball game incident 5 years ago being a prominent relatively recent exception). Their security is effective - even though there are just as many guns in society that could be used to attack politicians as there are that could be used to attack schools and children.
So why aren't similar measures implemented in relation to schools?
Possible answers:
A: Politicians and other government officials care more about their own safety than the safety of children.
B: Politicians would rather have an issue with which to leverage votes and media attention than to actually solve the issue.
C: Politicians realize that the general public doesn't want that degree of protection for their children because of the disruption and fear that could cause.
But if that's a/the reason, then that implies that the general public is ok with a lower level of safety for schoolchildren than for politicians... and that means that the general public will accept a higher amount of risk for schoolchildren potentially being the victim of a school shooting. That may well be - there are ALWAYS trade offs. We cannot rid the world of ALL risk... and ridding the world of even most risks results in a less than ideal day-to-day life).
These aren't easy issues.
But I can guarantee you that if government were actually legally liable for failing to protect children in government schools, then the children would be a lot better protected than they are now.
Government has chosen not to accept that liability. And the children suffer for it sometimes.
Perhaps we should have a national discussion about THAT issue at the same time that people are arguing about guns.
https://www.facebook.com/robwbright/posts/10158486466975925
I’m a parent of a child in a fatal school shooting on 12/13/2013 at Arapahoe Highschool , in the same district as Columbine in Littleton CO. I spent 9 years researching and speaking out as well as exposing lies cover ups and corruption. I’ll link you and others to 2 reports. Nicolletis secority report was invited to be read by LPS district. Dr Goodrums was ignored. At all our peril. Yes, security is important in terms of locked access to building. However if a shooter wants to get in they can. The doors open for each person buzzed in. The shooter can still grab the door. I know. I’ve done it. SROs ( security resource officers which are off duty cops ) have NEVER stopped a school shooting. And as far as I know by the time cops show up the shooters dead. Especially if the shooter was a student. I’m response Your # 5 comment about private schools : most private schools here a MuCH lower ratio of teacher to student which lowers stress on students ( and teachers ). Teachers are paid better and many top teachers work in private schools. This leaving unqualified incompetent unkind ones in public schools. Private schools don’t teach crap like Common Core or use unnecessary ( but a way to steal tax dollars and surveille students ) chrome books with Gates software and testing which causes severe depression among students. And teachers who must “ teach to the test “. Private schools aren’t top heavy with admin wfo are mostly degreed from online Phoenix University ( look up all admin background in public schools to get an idea ). Most private schools teach interesting subjects focused in real education. Parents won’t pay if their kids are unhappy and teachers or admin are unresponsive. Although I’m a SPED expert and have had all 3 of my kids in public , charter , private and homeschool , I’m a public school proponent. What’s occurring now for the past 40 years is neo liberal fascism. I’m a theories expert and. was a life long Democrat. None of these neo liberals or neo conservatives are “ liberal “ or “ conservative “. They’re not communists or Marxist’s as ignorant people throw these terms around. It’s fascism. Neither communism or “ free market “ Capitalism ever work. I’m also a pro 2nd amendment person. In terms of the cops , I’ve explored many school shootings. Many have been false flags ( yes with real or faked deaths ) and some are real shootings. Columbine was areal shooting with one kid who was a sociopath and Kleibold who was depressed and on psychotropic drugs. Other cases are MKULTRA. Arapahoe was real. The student / shooter was known to be a threat and the idiot admin CyA’d. They ignored and then fired the guards who knew and spoke out. The SRO never got to Pierson the shooter. The guards confronted Pierson. The SRO was awarded a medal from Arapahoe sheriffs Dept which he didn’t earn. I called all of it out and was attacked and gaslit. I single-handedly spoke out about bullying by admin and teachers against parents and kids. The truth finally came out in part. The new superintendent listened and admitted our district had bullying ,anti semitism ,racism ,homophobia . He wrote a letter to all family in district in 2016. LPS still hasn’t got text to alert. They left the admin criminals in charge. Suicides are down. But it’s still rotten. Cops are cowards for the most part and frankly this latest incident can’t just be chalked up to cowardice or incompetence. I believe some of it was synthetically created. I don’t believe all teachers should be armed unless they are lifelong gun enthusiasts. Some teachers who were allowed to carry had mental breakdowns ajd threatened innocent STUDENTS in the past. I do support conceal carry in schools strongly as it could definitely stop a shooter. I will link everyone to both national violence reports. Nicolletis report is NOT the answer. Yes it can help with non school student shooters. Public schools are ACTIVELY violating students sped rights ( special Ed ) and IEPs. They are mostly incompetent as well , not knowing sped law , as in the case of the student shooter at my sons school. Most public school admin bully amd intimidate parents students and teachers. It’s irrelevant if some parents suck. The law states publuc schools must serve ALL kids. Even. Kids with shitty parents. So blaming parents is useless and unproductive. 20% of all students are at risk whether they’re SPED, gifted, depressed or have other ED, and ignored sped kids wfo should be identified and serviced. Steve the dysarvabtaged instead of blaming and the shootings ajd suicides will plummet wfich protects ALL of our kids!This requires knowledge , intentional competency , emotional IQ and MONEY ! A lot of money is stolen through the avenues i mentioned plus more. Anyone interested in discussing this can email me with the subject line : School Shootings at hs4265@protonmail.com. Read the links before emailing please. Here are the violence reports and the link to my FB page I started a month after the shooting. Most reporters wouldn’t publicize the facts I exposed. My page : https://m.facebook.com/Parents-at-Arapahoe-High-school-643470752378413/. Nicollettis report : https://schoolshooters.info/sites/default/files/Threat_Assessment_Issues.pdf. Dr Sarah goodrum’s crucial report , ignored by LPS : https://cspv.colorado.edu/arapahoe-high-school-shooting-report-preventing-future-school-shootings-through-information-sharing-threat-assessment-and-systems-thinking/. Could someone please comment and respond whether they can see all 3 links and if those links worked please ? I can’t see it on my end for some reason. Ty
I can see all 3 links. Thank you!
Excellent points.
It’s “B,” obviously.
My x-husband cop and retired BIL trooper went into many volatile situations, not know what was on the other side. Both of these officers would risk their lives and go into an active shooting incident to save children - or anyone. Please don’t condemn ALL police. Investigate, once the truth comes out, those who were at fault should be dealt with.
I agree. My emotional reaction is of course to condemn all police, and I suspect that that's exactly one of the desired outcomes, totally in line with the BLM and ACAB bs that we've had to suffer these past years. The other desired outcome is of course the old banning of guns for citizens, leaving the monopoly on violence entirely in the hands of the ruling class.
The "official timeline" in the linked LA Times article also says:
"He was finally killed after more than an hour, after a Border Patrol special weapons team arrived."
However, a story on Fox News is saying that the Border Patrol officer that shot the killer was off duty and had responded after his wife, a teacher at the school, texted him requesting help.
"An off-duty US Customs and Border Patrol agent saved dozens of children trapped inside Robb Elementary Tuesday after his wife, a fourth-grade teacher at the school, texted him that there was an active shooter, according to a report"
https://www.foxnews.com/us/uvalde-texas-shooting-cbp-agent-saves-uvalde-students-daughter#
I think there were some cops that wanted to go in because some went in to get their kids in other classrooms.
However I said this three times in the last month as a caller into talk radio. I’m not sure that police and govt law enforcement are with the good guys and it’s time for them to choose. Why? The threat of losing their paychecks and pensions have them following the orders of their superiors and mayors and governors when they know it’s wrong.
How many dads and moms reading this would have gone in as non police officers to save those kids even if they aren’t our own? I bet on many. I would with no hesitation. Why did the police not? They were told to follow the process.
Can’t get the front door open? I don’t wait for a key. I drive my car through it. They were told they have to wait to breach.
The problem with all of these mass shootings is one of mental health in USA. Teenagers are more and more hypermedicated and making us suffer the consequences. When we start giving them anphetamines as kids, antidepressants as young teenagers and antipsychotics later on, something is not working in the American Health System these days. Nutrition is a big problem and also probable cause for this mental health crisis and we should not underestimate the role of hypervaccination in babies.
This is a more complex problem than it seems.
And then the kids make it worse with cannabis use. It’s a very, very bad situation.
Just wait until our military is tested and they don't have to fear being ostracized for doing their jobs. Our world is convoluted, confused and upside down. We cannot expect normal or good outcomes to be the rule anymore.
If it is true they stood outside and did nothing, they have blood on their hands.
I guess that every real men left the police after some cucks decided to embarrass the corporation by taking "the knee" for blm, antifa, and other criminals. Now these blm-kneeling cowards are all that is left in the police.
Lots of problems here. Cops vilified for shooting “people of color”, the George Floyd death and conviction, etc. makes them afraid to act out. The security door left unlocked “because the school year was ending” (?!) What I want to see are armed guards on duty at schools and, ideally, armed teachers or the impression of such. But if I was a parent I’d be homeschooling for this and other reasons. And find a cooperative way to do it even if I had little money.
Read my comment and the national violence report links
One news account reported there were only 4 cops. The city has a small police force. One wonders how well the 4 cops were trained in shooting cases like this.
So far I have found no corroboration of the claim that the shooter fired several rounds outside before he entered the school. Wouldn't that info have come from parents? How long had the children been in class?
Accusing the cops of cowardice seems both appropriate and a cheap shot. Were they wearing bullet protection vests? How well had they been trained for shooter intervention? The situation seems more like a unwinnable situation - someone was going to die, so the question came down to who.
Count me as cynical, but I doubt Americans will find common ground - excuses will be made. Perhaps the parents will be found guilty! And the MSM will eat it up.
They were cowards. They were stopping the parents from going in and handcuffed a mother. After she got out of the cuffs, she ran into the school and saved her 2 kids, even though the shooter was in the building. She had no training---she acted on instinct. Looks like the cops were trained to avoid doing anything.
Thank you for the update. Not one of those chicken s**t cops had the courage shown by a simple, untrained mum. Despicable lowlifes.
They had a 9 man SWAT team- so no way the department was as small as you think.
I got that number of 4 from some news web site. Who now is proven to be wrong.
What puzzles me is why a town of around 15,000 had such a large force anyhow? Did they ever really do anything?
"someone was going to die, so the question came down to who."
First, that's not true. Reports seems to show that law enforcement had body armor. It would be surprising if they didn't. As such, death of one or more officers was hardly guaranteed if they took action sooner.
And it is cowardice to answer that question by letting children be the ones to die while protecting yourself when YOU'RE A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER who has to receive weapons training before becoming an officer and have continuing training in the same.
The parents were willing to die to save their kids and law enforcement appears to have prevented them from doing so. That's not only cowardice, it's cruel.
Something to consider. The case of Sgt Dan O’Shea, Denver Police Department off-duty SWAT who led a small team of brave police to take on Klebold and Harris in Columbine while the rest of the LEO loitered outside trying to figure out what, if anything, to do as the rampage and carnage of innocent children continued inside. Investigated by his department, local and state prosecutors, sued by parents of a child killed claiming he was shot to death by O’Shea’s “reckless” intervention.
I knew Sgt Dan O’Shea. Long time veteran of DPD, instructor at the police academy, grizzled, tough cop who loved hard, lived life hard, did everything he did in life to the nth. Including putting his life on the line for others in harm’s way. Investigated, suspended and sued for his efforts.
Probably why so many of the LEO responders in Uvalde sat on their asses. And in Parkland. Despite protocols changing in every jurisdiction after Columbine, with hundreds of millions of dollars spent training local police departments. Still doing nothing, money and training wasted as children die in real time while police cowardly afraid to “protect and serve.”
I was with Sgt Dan O’Shea a few years after Columbine the night he took the call from his attorney telling him he was cleared of wrongdoing in the investigation and dropped from the lawsuit. He was a regular at a local bar I was a semi-regular at. Watching that man’s face, seeing his body, his entire being respond to the good news was a moment I’ll never forget. I shared his moment of vindication and the weight of the world that had weighed upon him for so many years after that tragic day leave him was powerful to behold. He bought the entire bar shots to celebrate, hugged many friends, me included as the news sunk in. This is what holds good police back from doing what Sgt Dan O’Shea did. Thing is, really good cops would do it anyways and suffer the consequences. Sgt Dan O’Shea would do it all over again the same way knowing what the next few years of his life would look like. They care that much. Rare today.
Fox are you in CO ? Read my post. Email me
It's not guns or cops. We need serious conversation about "why so many of our country’s most lost, most hateful people are boys with their whole lives ahead of them." Children killing children.
https://www.firstthings.com/web-exclusives/2022/05/the-children-who-kill-children